Queen Rania's Interview with CNN’s Christiane Amanpour

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR: Queen Rania, welcome back to our program. Can I first ask you… it is Ramadan. It has just started, and I wonder what your reflections are for yourself, for your family, for Muslims around the world, celebrating, or maybe that’s not the right word – marking – Ramadan this year in the middle of this war?

QUEEN RANIA: Well, you know, Christiane, Ramadan for us is a month of worship, charity and compassion for our fellow human being, and I think this year we're welcoming these holidays with very heavy hearts. Ramadan is typically defined with family gatherings, people coming together, sharing a meal and breaking their fast together. But what is it like for the people of Gaza today who are now hungry and thirsty in tents or makeshift shelters… who are mourning their dead and mourning the life that they had just a few months ago? You know, Christiane, since the beginning of this war, Israel has cut off everything that is required to sustain a human life: food, fuel, shelter, medicine, water… It has been going on now for five months, and it’s left the people of Gaza completely reliant on outside assistance. And actually, it has systematically denied and delayed a lot of that assistance, occasionally bombing some of the convoys that bring this assistance and shooting some of the people who are trying to get whatever scarce resources that they can get.

According to the UN, every single person in Gaza today is hungry. Over a quarter of the population – that's more than 550,000 people – are one step away from famine. Experts say that they have never seen a population descend into such mass hunger so rapidly. I mean, I'm hearing of people just eating whatever they can get their hands on including grass, or they're having to grind bird feed or animal fodder just to make bread. And in the north of Gaza, people are not on the verge of starvation; they're actually dying of starvation. It starts with the most vulnerable: the elderly, the wounded, babies... We're hearing of an increasing number of babies who are dying from severe malnutrition and thirst, and if things don't change, I think these cases are going to be spiraling throughout the Strip.

This has been a slow-motion, mass murder of children, five months in the making. Children who were thriving and healthy just months ago are wasting away in front of their parents. Starvation is a very slow, cruel, and painful death. Your muscles shrink, your immune system shuts down, your organs give out. Imagine being a parent, having to go through that, witness your child going through that, not being able to do anything to help. It is absolutely shameful, outrageous, and entirely predictable, what's happening in Gaza today – because it was deliberate.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR: Queen Rania, we have been reporting systematically what you are describing. In fact, a lot of the world, is now, and has been, reporting this severe hunger, the statistics, the pictures you are talking about. I wonder whether you think that is the reason why, for instance, the United States, the UK, other nations which are allies of Israel, have started to really ramp up the need to deliver aid. Like the airdrops that Jordan has been involved in, you see the US doing it, you see the idea of a floating pier in order to bring much more aid via the sea. Do you think the message that you’ve just described has actually now gotten through?

QUEEN RANIA: Well, look, let me just be very clear about what these air drops are. They are us resorting to desperate measures, in order to address a desperate situation. These air drops are literally just drops in an ocean of unmet needs. And King Abdullah has said from the very beginning, they are neither sufficient, nor are they a substitute for humanitarian access at scale. So countries should not use them as a way out, nor should they be viewed as an excuse for not doing what needs to be done. And that is implementing an immediate and sustained ceasefire; opening all access points into Gaza, particularly land routes; streamlining the inspection process; and making sure that there is safe access within Gaza so that the aid can be distributed.

Every moment counts. Children are starving as we speak. So every moment and every meal counts. And so, I think now we're past the stage of trying to talk Israel into doing these things; we need to actually start using measures and political leverage to get them to do those things.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR: Can I ask you to describe what Jordan has done? First of all, you’re sitting in an airbase…I believe behind you is some of the goods and humanitarian items that will be dropped. Tell me when they’re going to be dropped into Gaza, and how has Jordan’s experience been with, for instance, its hospital there, with the air-dropping?

QUEEN RANIA: Well, look, the reason why we started doing these air drops is we found that, after trying so hard in vain to persuade Israel to open the access points, the land access points, that we had to do something; we couldn't just sit idle and watch people starving. And so, King Abdullah started organizing these air drops. But I have to emphasize that the need is much greater than what we're being able to provide.

As it stands today, there are trucks, there's tons of food in trucks that are miles away from people who are starving. So the hunger is not a natural disaster. This is a man-made, an Israeli-made disaster. It is deprivation by design. No matter the volume of the aid going in, nothing is a substitute for a ceasefire. Delivering aid under bombardment does not stop the destruction, the death, and the heartbreak. We cannot save people from hunger only then to bomb them to death. So again, an immediate ceasefire is the number one priority.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR: So, clearly, Hamas has said that it wants a long-term ceasefire. As you’ve heard, not only the Israeli government, but also the US president said, that when they thought there was a possibility of a ceasefire, and a release of hostages, and you know, much increased aid into Gaza. The last thing we heard was that it’s up to Hamas to sign on. What does Jordan believe to be the sticking point with a ceasefire?

QUEEN RANIA: Look, I'm not privy to the specifics of the negotiations. What I do know is that, from a humanitarian perspective, we need to secure a ceasefire as soon as possible so that aid operations can be restored at scale, so that people can start burying their dead, so that they can start healing. This has been going on for way too long. And this is not a time to hold out for political victories. There are no victories to be had, as long as this war continues. There's only loss after loss after loss.

And I believe that the international community really needs to weigh in. Israel has been able to operate with impunity, and that has really affected the credibility of many countries in the West. Now, I'm happy to see that some nations have changed their positions, have shifted. A country like France, we're very grateful to President Macron, who has called for a ceasefire and who has been with us executing these airdrops right from the beginning. Countries like Spain, Belgium, Ireland, South Africa, Latin America, all these countries are asking for a ceasefire. We've seen solidarity from the global public, and, you know, exceptional solidarity from the global public. And that's sometimes created a rift between the public and their own leaders, including places where you are, where the public is wondering when are their governments going to start taking more decisive positions?

It's just that every time a child is being pulled out of the rubble, the credibility of countries, even like the United States, their values of equality, justice and human rights, they're called into question. People in my part of the world are not only angry, they are disillusioned and disappointed. Many people admired western values, and now they're having to rethink their worldview, because they're asking, you know, how come human rights are granted to some and denied to others.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR: So, president Biden publicly urged no offensive into Rafah – saying that I cannot sit back and see another 30,000 deaths in Gaza, and said to Israel that it would cause more damage to the Israeli cause than benefit Israel. Then Netanyahu responds saying: my red line is: no more Hamas, no more threats, and by the way, no state! No two-state solution. So, what is Jordan thinking about not just the immediate, but the day after? Because clearly you are the country – one of them – that does believe in two states, and does have a peace treaty with Israel?

QUEEN RANIA: Well, look Christiane, I think it's no coincidence that we're witnessing one of the most violent episodes of this conflict under one of the most hardline, racist governments in Israel's history. Prime Minister Netanyahu, by his own admission, says that his policy was based on ‘divide and conquer’; covertly propping up Hamas in order to undermine the Palestinian Authority, and then say there's no partner for peace.

Last year, even before October 7, we had set a record in terms of settlement expansion and construction. Just last week, the Israeli government approved plans to build 3,500 more illegal settlements on occupied West Bank land. And sure, some of its allies condemned those plans. But, as in previous cases, there's condemnation, but then the plans are carried out. As long as Israel is allowed to get away with breaking international law – as long as its allies don't hold it accountable – it will just increase its sense of impunity.

So, for years, Israel talks peace, but then condemns it to death by settlements, making a contiguous, independent Palestinian state less viable by the day. And, for the longest time, we hear the international community talking about a two-state solution, while allowing Israel to create a one-state reality.

And so, you know, I think the time for trying to persuade Israel to do the right thing has long passed… When you look at the horrendous reality that's in Gaza today, it is hard to believe that Israel's being unfairly singled out – that it's being held to a higher standard. Critics of Israel merely want it to do the bare minimum, which is just abide by international law.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR:  Obviously, you were received at the White House along with the King. You also went to Capitol Hill, where some of the strongest support does reside. What message did you deliver on Capitol Hill, and what did you hear from them?

QUEEN RANIA: Well, I think a lot of people need to know more about this conflict, to really understand the intricacies of it, to understand that this is one of the greatest historical injustices. And, to understand what the root cause of this issue is, to understand that this conflict did not begin on October 7, that it was a result of years of occupation, of settlement expansion, of human rights abuses, of disregard for international law. And this is what led us to this point.

You know, if we look at Israel today – you know, sometimes you hear the Prime Minister justifying the war by saying that he is doing what the public wants, and that the overwhelming majority of Israelis support this war. Well, you know, I refuse to believe that an entire population can look at what's going on in Gaza and be okay with it.

In Israel, the dehumanization of Palestinians is systematic, it's ingrained, it is ubiquitous… They believe that ‘if we don't kill them, they're going to kill us.’

And so I blame hardline Israeli leaders for keeping their people in this perpetual state of fear of an existential threat that doesn't exist, and making them feel like just killing Palestinians and killing Hamas is going to be the solution to the problem. The real solution to the problem is to end the occupation. Palestinians do not hate Israelis because of who they are. They hate them because of what they're doing to them.

And so, the greatest guarantee for Israel's security, and this is what I said to the Americans: If you want to safeguard Israel's security, there is no better way to do it than through a just and comprehensive peace. No army in the world, the strongest army in the world, the most proficient intelligence, whatever, will not guarantee Israel's security as much as a just and comprehensive peace would. We, in this part of the world, need to find a way to share these holy lands in peace.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR: I mean basically the Israeli public does support the war because: a) they want their people back, and b) they don’t want to live side by side with Hamas at all, ever again. They don’t want to be in that situation or under that threat. And you said it doesn’t present an existential threat.

Hold on a second. Hold on a second. I mean the question is: if it was you , and you were to give a speech, or a visit to the Israeli people, who said to you that Queen Rania: you may have a peace treaty with us, but look what Hamas did to us on October 7. What would you say to them about how they should – I mean you’ve talked about the history… but there is such a trauma that everybody we talked to now says it’s still as if it’s October 7, even though Prime Minister Netanyahu’s ratings are in the dumpster. They don’t support him. But they do support the idea of not having that threat anywhere near them anymore.

QUEEN RANIA: You know, I would say that, as devastating and as traumatic as October 7 was, it doesn't give Israel license to commit atrocity after atrocity. And Israel experienced one October 7. Since then, the Palestinians have experienced 156 “October 7s.” They have been going through this every day. And prior to October 7, they have been living in 50 years of oppression, of occupation, of having their movement restricted, having every aspect of their lives dominated, being humiliated.

If I were to speak to the Israeli public, I would say, if you want your peace and your security, you have to address this big injustice that's on your doorstep. There is no shortcut, there is no security measure that is going to bring the more hopeful future and the stability that you want in your lives, other than finding a way to live with Palestinians.

Israeli leaders must stop treating the existence of Palestinians as an inconvenient truth, as a demographic challenge, as a lawn that needs to be mowed every now and then. Palestinians are here to stay. And so we have to find a way to live with one another. And we have to be able to re-humanize, to be able to see our humanity reflected in another's eyes. You know, an Israeli mother should understand that a Palestinian mother cares about her children just as much as she does. And there's just no way around that. I don't believe that peace is just about politics – peace is about state of mind. It's about – it's a culture, it's about values. And those are the values that really need to be addressed, and they're long overdue.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR: Queen Rania thank you very much for joining us.

QUEEN RANIA: Thank you, Christiane.